Writing about what you don’t know
I have this idea of a screenplay that has to do with Navy SEALs. However I am not familiar with them. I have also
heard that as a writer one should be more inclined to write what they know about.
Should I follow this advice or can I find ways of developing this idea through research? Is it necessarily that all screenwriters have an absolute clue about what their stories venture into?
– Andrew
If screenwriters only wrote about subjects they knew intimately, most screenplays would be about Tetris, television or getting picked last for team sports.
Write about what interests you. If you don’t know enough about Navy SEALs, research everything you can on them until you’re a pseudo-expert. Here’s the test for whether you’ve done enough research: have you annoyed all your friends and loved ones talking about all the interesting facts you’ve learned about Navy SEALs? Great. Now you’re ready to start writing.
Articles
January 12th, 2005 at 7:11 pm
I’m sure people know about http://www.moviecliches.com/ – which illustrates the idea that movies are written (often) based on what we (the viewing public) already believes about the topic at hand.
I’m not saying don’t do research, I’m just acknowledging that there is a set of tropes out there that the audience will recognize just from having consumed filmed entertainment in the past…
January 12th, 2005 at 11:35 pm
Being in special operations and having worked with SEALs, I can tell you that you probably can’t write about it accurately if you haven’t been there. But, most of the country hasn’t been there, so they wouldn’t know. If you’re cool with that, then you’re fine. But, there are SO many other interesting units in the military that aren’t Hollywood cliches. No more SEAL movies, please.
January 13th, 2005 at 12:46 am
The real challenge is, can your script get made Michael Biehn is not available?
January 13th, 2005 at 12:45 pm
Note that it’s not necessary to be totally accurate in your portrayal. You only have to paint things with a bit more accuracy than the bulk of your audience expects, or already knows about the subject.
I don’t see this as cynical, by the way; I’m not looking down on your audience. You’re not writing a documentary, so there will always be some “truth” concession made to drama and narrative. You might as well extend that set of concessions to the background, as well.
If that makes any sense.
January 13th, 2005 at 2:42 pm
I’ve always thought that the dictum “Write what you know” is more than a little misleading, as it discourages research. Instead, my version is “Know what you write.”
January 13th, 2005 at 4:18 pm
You could always attend Marine boot camp during the summer. You don’t have to commit to enlisting to go, they ask you at the end if you want to join up. While it’s not SEAL training, it might give you a good perspective. You’d be like Hunter S. Thompson, only without the drugs, booze and sex.
Plus, Jeff makes a good point. Accuracy is important, but only to the extent that it serves story. You’re telling a story. CSI is a prime example of this. A documentary about forensics is a completely different bird than a fictional account of crime fighters using forensics.
If documentaries or tv specials about SEALs are available on DVD, rent ‘em or buy ‘em. Call the Navy, ask ‘em for a video about the SEALs, I bet they have one.
January 13th, 2005 at 8:15 pm
I’m still laughing about the tetris, televion, and sports remark for some reason.
Anyhow, I did a script that had a bit with the SEALs in it, but I did no research at all. Like some have already said, I only used as much as I needed to. I didn’t delve deep enough into the core workigns of the SEALs to call for research, but it sounds like you’re going all in.
You’re bound to know a marine or two (hell, I know more marines or ex-marines than I have fingers). Ask someone who has been in the Corps about the marines. If you’ve got a basic knowledge of the marines in general, it’s a good starting place and they’re likely to know a few stories from the SEALs as well. Whether they’re true or not…
February 8th, 2005 at 7:24 am
Being a writer and former SEAL, I have to say that one of the hardest things in finding out information about us is that we don’t like telling others about all the fun and crazy things we did normally. As for research on the SEALs I recommend you put the pen aside for now and pick up several books by Richard Marcincko known by us as Demo Dick or the Rogue Warrior since while the books he writes are fiction don’t take everything as true but they really tell a lot about what training really is like and some of the assignments are like. If you want to talk to me that’s great but I only was a SEAL due to my finishing training, I never got to see action due to an injury in a traing assignment. The comments on Corps training is sort of a good one, but at the same time the Marines don’t really have any training that comes close to equaling our own and talk to the regualar Navy guys since the may have had contact with us.
June 15th, 2005 at 1:30 pm
ya, bullshit you were a SEAL. Of the 4500 SpecialOp personnel in the Navy one just happens to come here. Well thanks to the internet everyone on the planet claims to be an operator. And yes the Marines have many things comparable and better than that of BUD/S training. The Recon units and MEUs are much better trained. The length of becoming a Recon operator is 4 times the length of that to be a SEAL. The MEUs are entire units that are trained in Special Operations missions, which is better because they are training as a unit and not an individual who gets thrown on a team like others. Don’t compare Marine boot to BUD/S because Marine boot camp is only what it takes to be the most basic Marine. Even if you have the most tit job in the Corps you have to complete it. Navy, Army and Air Force basic do not even compare to Marine boot camp. SEALs are all hollywood hype. Can anyone here name one famous battle won by the SEALs? Because I sure as hell could name atleast 30 to the Marines credit. Let me make clear that im not bashing the SEALs or any other personnel im just sick of all this “SEALs do this and that” crap. They bleed the same shade of red as anyone else in the military.
June 16th, 2005 at 6:59 am
Just wanted to comment that I was a hospital corpsman in the Navy, and I personally knew several corpsmen who were unable to make it through BUD/S training, but subsequently went “green side” and made it through Force Recon training. The training may be longer, but that doesn’t necessarily make it harder or better. You’re certainly right about boot camp though. My boot camp was a piece of cake compared to the Marines’.
Eric may or may not be a fake. Lots of people claim to have been SEALs when they weren’t. But just because there are only 4500 in the Navy doesn’t mean there are only 4500 FORMER SEALs in the world. Having a former SEAL reading this site is far from improbable.
July 13th, 2005 at 4:02 pm
Okay… I’ll try to be as factual as possible, adding as little of opinion as possible. There are two main fighting forces the U.S. Department of Defense has to offer, the U.S. armed forces and U.S. SOCOM (Special Operations COMmand). Well, we could also include the Black Ops, however, those areas are so rarely talked about because so, so little is known about them. In the regular armed forces, we have the U.S. Marines (older than the U.S. itself) also the Marines are the Department of the Navy, we have the U.S. Army, U.S. Navy, U.S. Air Force and the U.S. Coast Guard. In SOCOM, we have forces such as the U.S. Navy SEALs, U.S. Army Green Berets, U.S. Marine Force Recon and the U.S. Marine Raiders (Army also has it’s own raiders). I’m more than sure other forces operate in SOCOM, but don’t know the exact units. As far as regular armed forces goes, I’d have to say as far as discipline, basic training, toughness and the kind of “you work with what you already got” attitude, the Marines are by far the cream of the crop in those areas. Afterall, the Marines have to be since they’re the only armed force which operates land, air and sea and they can be deployed anywhere in the world within a 24-hour notice. Also, the Marines are the only armed force that works directly for the President of the U.S. (others work for congress). As for the others in these areas, though they have probably better, more state-of-the-art weapons available and better educational programs, as far as survival and working with what you got goes, the Army, Navy and Air Force would be almost instantly crushed by your Marine. As far as Special Operations goes, your Navy SEAL is the best of the best. Now, people don’t really argue on whether the Marines are better than the Green Berets or the other SOCOM units, however, they always fight on whether or not the Marines are better than the SEALs. Now, most would think this is s no brainer. Not true, of course, your average Marine basic training graduate whose only a sergeant rank is not as good in combat as your BUD/S (Basic UnderWater Demolition SEALs training) basic training fireteam commando. However, because Marines are the elite of the elite of the armed forces, they wouldn’t require much more training than what they’ve already received to carry out a mission your average SEAL fireteam commando is more commonly called upon to carry out. What I’m tired of is always hearing the SEALs are this and the SEALs are that, well, I hate to say, but… if the SEALs really are so great, please explain to me the capturing of a Navy SEAL fireteam commader in the Mid East. Not only that, I believe two other SEALs on that same fireteam were found dead by a naval special unit searching for them. What I’m saying is, the SEALs are not as elite as the media and the public wants you to believe. Many other more elite groups exist out there besides them, groups that probably, whether given the chance or not, could bury your SEAL alive. It is agreed by many that Marine Snipers are very elite and very good at what they do. I know one thing, if I ever join the military, it will without doubt be the Marines.
July 28th, 2005 at 1:09 am
Just as a side note for “Comment by Monty”…They don’t ask you if you wanna stay in after Marine bootcamp…You stay in…or lose alot of money. ^u^ Have a nice day!
April 6th, 2006 at 3:42 am
well at least zach isnt trying to pose. however where do you get all of your info having never been in the military. navy seals best of the best? you forgot about CAG. oh wait you dont know what that is. let me hollywoodize it for you “delta”
June 1st, 2006 at 11:24 am
ILike what i have read, because have you ever notice there are movies out there about all the special forces,but answere this which special force do you here of more.yes, navy seals,. I like when everything was a secret, cause it strike fear in people heart when they see marine force recon,navy seal,green barret,delta force,and pj do there job.all people would do is say who are they? were did they come from? they all would reply from hell and thats how i want it to be again, no more am a seal,green barret,delta force,pj,marine recon, so only the marine recon/force, green barret,marine raider, armyraider and pj are trying to uphold this, but guess who’s left and always braging. I’ll tell you a story, a friend of mines is force recon.i dont recall were he was but is unit was continuousely training,so one of his buddy whent over to a couple of seal member and ask why are you guy not training, they reply cause were seals. two days later,guess who was call for help, yes the elite navy seal, so after that same recon unit accomplished their mission, they wer on there way to extract the seal and finish their mission because they had men that were wounded and 1 killed. so be careful what you say. semper fi
June 28th, 2006 at 6:14 pm
Hello everyone, Im in the Navy and recently left the BUD/S program in which i DOR’ed. In a class of 125 we had over 10 prior devil dogs taking the seal challege. Even though we didnt talk to much most of them were infantry, REcon and a few Force recon. Now why would a Force Recon guy want to quite what he had for him and give BUD/S a shot? Simply because its more challenging. Oh and the 4500 seals thing more like 2000. These days the SEALS are asked to do the jobs that everyone else wants due to the fact that there training is more advanced than other services. The corp is getting tired of this and is starting the remaking of the “Raiders” which will be primarily trained with a Navy Seal team. If you want the get in there bullet sponge kind of unit go with a marine battallion. But any highschool terd can become a infantryman in the corp, army or even the new sand sailors. They are trained well but not even close to the extent a seal, recon, green beret, or PJ is. SO please quite comparing a marine grunt to any special force. Also techonology, Seals work with the best shit. The Navy still gives the Corp 3% of all its income. ONly reason the seals have become so hollywood is cause they need more kids to join the numbers are getting higher and higher. By the way only 2 devil dogs made it through the BUD/S training one Ex seargent(e-5) now a 1st class (e-6) Force Recon and a LCPL infantry kid made it through. enough said. SEAL team 6= DU GRU= Delta the top guys in the service. which is not army but all branches.
August 1st, 2006 at 5:49 pm
Marine Recon’s mission is comperable to that of the seals. Boths units conduct reconnaissance, survailenca, and direct action missions. As far as the special Operations community is concearned it is wrong to try and compare any one group as being better than another. All serve diffenert missions in many different forums though many of these missions may be simular. If you are truley curious about the special operations community, stop jaw-jacking and get off your ass. Go see if you have what it take to be an operater. Oh and by the way I have no idea why anybody would undergo all the traing that is nessecary to be a Recon Marine and then start all over at the bottom so they could be a seal.
August 24th, 2006 at 3:52 am
It’s funny how people are so loyal to their branch of the military. Whether they serve for that branch or their father or brother did.Now me myself I am in the Army and an infantryman. People always want to feel proud of themselves because it makes them feel good to boast. Which is totally fine. I know in the Amry we bag on any non-combat arms job. Or even other combat arms like calvery of tankers. Then the Rangers make fun of us despite their jokes we admire and look up to the Rangers. Then You have the Special Forces or “Green Berets”, they make fun of the Rangers and the Infantry. Then you have branch rivalry which is much to extensive to explain. Now I have learned to accept the fact that the Marine Infantry is probaly more effective in combat and are more willing to get the job done than we are. That is O.K. with me my brother was Army and my brother in law was an Army Ranger. So I belived it was my duty to follow the tradition and join the Army. As it turned out I am very glad that I joined the Army. All I want to say is that there is a war for Gods sakes and although people don’t like to admit it we are a team. The government created each branch and each Special Op unit or detachment because they wanted our Armed Forces to be the best in the world. This I know I can say for sure. I am station at Rose Barracks Vilseck, Germany and when we see German military we are sure to tell them that we are better. Really though each part of the military was created to make it more diverse and more dynamic so we can act or react to any situation better than anyone in the world. I know that the U.S. Army is good, maybe not as good as the Navy SEALs. However do we need to be. My job is tuned to fight a large opposing ground force. Now could a SEAL or Green Beret take my place and do my job better than me, you better believe it. However if you took 2,000 SEALs and Replaced all of the Army Infantrymen they would not be near as effective. Why because I accept the fact that all I am when it comes down to it is a person that holds a piece of land and catches bullets. Now maybe one day I will feel that I am good enough at that job to try out for Rangers who are Infantrymen for the most part but made up of the best of them and do it a hell of alot better. I am sure the same rule applies for the Marines and for the Navy or the Airforce with it’s P.J.’s. In the end we are just people serving our country the best way we can with the chance of losing our lives. I bet during the Vietnam war the Marines Rifleman and the Army Infantryman had grudges against eachother but when your pinned down and they arrive as reinforcements and drive off the enemy you can’t love them enough even if they are a chow hall cook.
October 17th, 2006 at 12:03 am
Hey “Eric is a POSER”, I cannot believe that you are seriously talking about the Marines winning a battle on their own. I think you are full of it and need to have more respect for your United States Military as a whole. You can’t and will never be able to do anything on your own. Are you in Iraq, have you been? I know my husband and his unit it. They are doing their part! You must have a lot of freedoms to be able to sit and research and comment on useless pages. I, however, do have the time and will comment as I please. I have freedom because I am a citizen of the united states and because of ALL men and women supporting our nation. You don’t see them claiming to have single handedly taken on a battle. Please consider what your saying. Is it even possible? Doubt it sweetie!
As far as the writing of this play. Good luck and I agree with Eric, talk to as many SEALs new and old. Michelle Rose Barracks Vilseck Germany
PROUD SUPPORTER OF THE UNITED STATES ARMY AND ALL IT’S FORCES Remember, freedom is and had never been free. Someone’s son or daughter had to die for that right! Stay safe all you military angels.
November 10th, 2006 at 6:10 am
[...] Still, films about film are strange territory. Yes, there is certainly room for the kind of clever, satirical writing which pops up in Shades from time to time, but there’s also a danger of using the opportunity to riff on, or slate, people in the industry while forgetting about the audience, a trap that Shades seems sometimes to be teetering on the edge of. It’s good for writers to write what they know, but as John August said: “If screenwriters only wrote about subjects they knew intimately, most screenplays would be about Tetris, television or getting picked last for team sports”. [...]
November 26th, 2006 at 1:31 pm
Seems like most of you are talking out of yer arses. The Marine corps did not have any special forces until recently becuase they claimed that all Marines were special operational ready. So that pretty much proves that the general Marine is more highly trained in direct action operations. Marines added Force Recon to the SOCOM becuase they were getting passed over on operations becuse they didnt have any units that were titled elite. Yes Marine Force Recon are bad ass. Yes SEALs are bad ass. Force Recon isn’t even the most bad ass of the Marines. In 2003 a new unit was created called Detachment One.
If I were to write a screenplay, I would not use either SEALs or Force Recon. I would write about 1st Special Forces Operational Detachment Delta.
November 26th, 2006 at 7:54 pm
My name is mac, i am in the Marines and all i have to say is most of you are crazy. i am your basic 0311 rifleman. SEALs are better the Recon, Recon are better then SEALs, Marines are better than the army. this is whole horse shit. each force has their own job to do. The SEALs are very good at what they do, Marine Recon is very good too, but one is not better than the other. they are tasked with diffrent types of missions. SOCOM uses what unit they think will be the most effective in order to complete the mission. if it is a martime mission, they will probably use the SEALs or Force Recon/Recon. if it is on land they might go with Army Special Forces or Rangers. however all spec op units are trained to work on land air and sea. the army is typically an occupying force and the marines are the spearhead. you do not see this in the Iraq war because there simpily are not enough people in the military. but that is generally how it goes. each branch does a fantastic job at what they do. as for the BUD/s training, it is a damn hard thing to go through and i wish anyone luck who goes out for it, however RIP is just as hard. i heard some people say that some recon guys who went out for BUD/s and called it quits, RIP training is diffrent from BUD/s, however that does not mean one is harder than the other. I’d like to see any of you complete RIP, BUD/s, Ranger school, or Army Special Forces. i would like to give much praise to Army Special Forces however, they are the only spec op unit that are REQUIRED to learn at least one other language and be fluent in it. they are also conducting most of the operations in Afganistan, trying to stop the drug flow because most of it comes back to here!!! As for basic training, Marine Boot is the most physically and mentally demanding. Navy Boot and Coast Guard Boot is spent mostly in the classroom and Army Boot is only 8 weeks long. Marine Boot is 13 weeks, about 3 months long, the longest basic training in the U.S. Military. To end this i respect all branches and we all work as a team to get the job done, and i thank all servicemen and women for answering the call, past or present.
SEMPER FI!!!!!!!
Mac USMC
December 23rd, 2006 at 1:24 am
Alot of people engage in this debate. theres no definate answer as to who is the best Green Beret, Navy SEAL, or PJ. Marine or RECON does not count since ther is no Marine Unit under SOCOM. Yes, Recon is not SOCOM but they are Special Operations capable. The Marines turned down an option to start a SOCOM Unit in the early 1980’s when Socom started. to this day they started Marsoc in 2006 which is the first Marine Spec-Ops unit…its supposed to mirrer the berets where marines will rotate in and out during there career. BUD/s training is the hardest most arduous military training in the U.S. military (80%) attrition rate. No other course comes close. SEAL’s are trained in Sea, Air, and Land as this makes up the acronym of their name Sea,Air, Land…the “e” is added to complete the word SEAL. SEAL’s are regarded to be the foremost CQB (Close Qaurter Battle) operators in the world. They are trained in ever spc-ops specialty you can imagine. its a joke in the spec-ops community that “If someone teaches it, then a SEAL has most likely learned it”. The Navy’s Counter Terrorism unit or DEVGRU is the maritime version of DELTA. it started out as a advanced unit of SEALs that would cover 75% of the globe as Delta would cover the rest. After it was apparent that DEVGRU operators where in better physica condition than DELTA (it’s regarded that DEVGRU SEALs are as close to a G.I. physique as you find in any nations mlitary). NO SEAL has EVER been captured alive. This the only unit in the U.S. military that can claim this. A few have been captured dead. In afghanistan 2002 petty officer Neil Roberts was captured Dead after falling out of Chinook helicopter after it dodged sharptly to aviod an RPG. He was on the ground alone after facing a few dozen enemy. he killed 2 dozen of them with one M-4 carbine and a Berreta 92f sidearm. After expending all of his ammunition he continued to fight off enemy by way of hand to hand combat. he managed to knock down (its not clear if he killed any with H2H combat but its doubted). He was wouned and died immediatly from a close range ak-47 round. the enemy took his body and proceeded to mutilate it unitil they left it for good. In June 2005 in Afghanistan. a 4 man reconassaince SEAL team from SEAL SDV 1 was sent into the hills of the Kunar provence on a search for Taliban personal, Bin Laden included. The SEAL were given bad intelligence and they ran into 50 plus Taliban. They fought off and killed a dozen in two hours. when there ammo was running out, the LT. called in for an air rescue. It was during this time the LT. was shot and killed instantly as he made his body succesptable to fire by reaching for the radio. the second man was also killed in action while checking the LT’s vital signs. One man was critically wounded from a previous woun…the 4th man tried to drag him to safety on the side of the mountain. the taliban sent a morter round and knocked them both off the mountain. one died fromt he round and one evaded the onslaught for a while until he got shot in the a$$. the operator claimed he laughed in disbeleif becuase he knew he was going to catch shit for the Forrest Gump million dollor wound. He continued to fight off taliban until he escaped and evaded to safety. he survived only to find out that the rescue chopper in bound got to the site but was shot down by an RPG. The 8 SEAL and 4 amry men on board were killed in the crash instantly. In September 2006 PO2 Michael Monsoor was killed in action during an op where he an 3 other SEALs in snipers nest came under fire….there position came known by the enemy and a grende was tossed into the hide out…almost immediatly after it hit the round PO2 Monsoor jumped on it and prevented the shrapnel from killing any of his SEAL brothers. It is said that he is up for nomination for the Conressinal Medal of Honor. These are all the SEAL deaths in the War on Terror and Iraq. there was one other SEAL who was killed in a firefight. So if my math is right thats 13 SEALS…only 5 killed in combat on the ground…considering they have killed over 150 “key” enemy that ratio is a testemant to there training. While the Berets, Marine Units, and Pj’s are outstading soldier…it is the SEAL who have proven by number of succesful ops, enemy capture, and kill to casualty ratio how they are the most lethal unit engaged int he conflicts in the middle east. the majority of the men at BUD/s are Naval Academy grads (hardest military academy to get into), ex marines, sailors that jioned the Navy just for te SEALs. It is rare for a non academy man to get an “O” slot to BUD/s since a SEAL officer commission is the most coveted commission int he military along with Navy fighter pilot.
December 23rd, 2006 at 1:30 am
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OperationRedWing
December 28th, 2006 at 11:40 pm
Well folks if you put them all in the arena and started a fight they would all come out winners – and lucky for you guys arguing their would be no loosers. The comments above truly would make a non-fiction story. I personally can only recall Marines that helped SEAL’s out of trouble and SEALS that help Marines.
A humored USMC Vet (1st and 3rd Force Service)
January 6th, 2007 at 8:58 pm
You guys who are not even even in the service and are arguing over this petty shit are FAGS. HooYah to anyone who’s in and takes pride in their job.
Being a Navy Deep Sea Diver is where it’s at: The pay is great. You get wet with a cool yellow helmet on your nugget without even having to swim well. -And the best part of the job is that You get to drink a lot of beer and fuck wild women all over the world!
January 8th, 2007 at 1:22 pm
if u guys are really into the best of the best, then just bare with me for a bit. S.A.S Special Air Service!!! The original spec ops that the U.S copied cause they thought spec ops weren’t required. But u stuffed up that big SPECIAL OPS in Iran in 1980 big time didnt u! Didnt even make to the country! dahh seahawks over desert. Bloody too stupid too realise the engines of a sea hawk helicopter dont go well when they have sand in them. u need arescue force for ur rescue force. And u call that professional and the best? The SEAL’s stuffed up panama big time! Nearly all were killed! Next time ask somebody who knows what they are doing like the British SAS! The only reason why Israel stayed out of the war in Desert storm was because the S.A.S were operating there. THE ONLY REASON!!! By the way it’s not about the technology u have or how hard u are trained, its about professionalism, experience and getting the job done!! I’m talking about “the soldier”! Have u ever wondered why Australia and its populaton of only 20 million comes 3rd in the Olympic games? Its because they have the most athletes per head of population in the world. If Australia multiplied their medal tally by the U.S population which is 15 times they would probably stop competeing. Now the reason im telling u this is because u guys are all about finding the best when u fail to realise that the only best thing about the U.S is ur economy. Therefore u have a large military and so fourth. But we are talking about the best yes?? Seals? i dont think so!! Panama… failed!! Lebanon in the early 80’s… failed! Vietnam u all failed! Pearl harbour… hahaha didnt even see it coming! Iraq um yeah doing a great job there guys. the only reason u won independence from the Brtis is because France came to the rescue. U hated france when they wouldn’t support the coalition of the willing to invade Iraq after the UN inspectors said there was nothing. The only reason why other countries helped was because of politics and to stay under that big nuclear bomb protection umbrella u have. U see u fail to realise i mean truly realise where u actually come on the scale of professionalism. U stole jewish scientist who were working for the nazi’s to create ur bombs and make ur rockets. The Russians invented there own much better rockets. So please spare me this American we are the best bull crap! U have numbers and money and that is all. Yes quantity is a quality all of its own. But some of u dont know ur ass from ur face. Ok where was I… the British Gave you special forces knowledege but they dont give all there knowledge over. Now the 22nd SAS regiment would have to be the best in my mind. But u guys arent really interested in other countries cos u think u have it all when reality says… yeah whatever!! The British SBS wipes there ass with SEALS. READ about it cause nobody on this site knows jack shit it seems to me! I’d then have to say the israeli spec ops would wipe there ass with ur spec ops too and the Russian Spetznatz… well ur not even in the same league. But going back to that Australian thing. Most athletes per head of poulation. 20 million people and in the first 2 weeks of the olympic games and Australia are 1 and US are 2. WHY???? u beat them because ur african americans take charge because of the tracks, white guys aint got nothing, and because u have 15 times the population and 10000 times the economy. Australia doest call their military “soldiers” they call them diggers why? Find out why, learn about the world. U guys want to know about the best right?? Is it too hard to read these days? does everything need to be googled? Did u know that the 2 chinooks sent to Afganistan to work under the US were in 7 days given the command and lead of ur 27 chinooks on varies missions? Did u know about the US spec ops stuff up that saw a handfull of delta and Seals downed in which a huge rescue mission was mounted of more spec ops thatwas also downed? 100 spec ops soldiers! ambushed! All were taught when under heavy fire to drop ur packs and get the hell out of there. All except the Australian SAS. Taught that comms are ur life line. Leave ur packs and u r already dead. 6 SAS diggers killed over 100 taliban made to a high secure location where they could call in a direct accurate bombing raids to save the US hyped sorry for an excuse soldiers ass. Atleast they had the respect back at base to stand aside in the chow line to let the Aussie SAS diggers right of way. please dont talk about who’s better than who when u are all just a shadow of what the British SAS are. Even ur president said that the Australian defence force are the best in the world. in 1998 when i was in the defence force all alied countries competed in spec ops training execises. in 36 years which was at the time 18 years before u even had spec ops besides ur green berets that are like british regulars… out of 36 competions Australian SASR won 30, Britain 22nd SAS 4 and British gurkas 2. USA. NIL. NONE. ZILTCH. NADA. probalby because Australia has the most athletes per head of population and USA has the FATEST people in the world per head of population. Now if u think this doesnt reflect through ur military and also through ur Spec ops thenu’d be ilogical stupid and too patriotic to know ur ass from ur face. Sorry to say guys but u Arent the best. U never were. the only thing thats best about u guys is that u have the money to set up good barraks and good kit. But dont ever make the mistake of comparing ur soldiers that come from the fatest nation in the world to those of countries who truly are the best. Now i kow this is gonna hurt some ego’s out there but what i have told u is completely true. The only problem is u guys are only interested in urselves. u have a great econmy thanks to those immigrants u bought over. And thx to that economy u guys have a large military and very powerful weapons thx to the jewish scientists. U have great rockets thx to Von brown who u took from germany. But never make the mistake that just because u make movies that glorify urselves that u have the the operators of countries that taught u and gave u the knowledge. Its not about the fancy tech stuff its about the soldier. The get the job done hard as nails professional. Not panama not lebanon. Not vietnam not iraq. More like the iranian emabassy siege in london. more like the gsg9. Germans who invented blitzcrieg and soldiers of air land and sea. But to end it all. The bst in the world are truly… and u can love it or leave it. But it really is the Australian SAS. U know… those guys from the country that has the most athletes per head of population. Only 20 milllion people and come 3rd or 4 th or fifth in the olympics. Those guys are the best! THE AUSTRALIAN SAS. been in operation since the 50’s and derived from other spec ops since 1900’s. So pls enough about ur hollywood heroes pls. Because we other people of this world are sick of it. We dont usually talk about our forces at all. But u guys make bloody movies and tv shows and how u r always the best when its so not true. I know patriotism forces u to believe this but its not a fact. to be honest u guys havnt done to well in alot of cases. But history is written by those who make big budget movies and bull shit stories about themselves. Its written by those who invade countries for oil. Its written by money hungry brain washing governments that conspire stories to get what they want. U guys only see urselves in this world and not others. But we see ouselves and u also. And its like being at a circus. Thank god we get to turn off and come back to real life. U guys really need to sort out ur government cos those guys will be the end of u. the french did it in the french revolution. strip urselves of ur ego’s and false sense of securities and go back to square one cos that what its gonna take to come back to earth and join the rest of us people in reality. Sorry if this sounded offensive but we get ur crap every day on tv and news papers so bare with me while i let off some steam. By the way… jerry springer is not a good window to the world on ur country. Shoot rupid murdoch and tear down fox news. be realistic, dont be so up urselves, learn about other countries, (no… ireland is not a pretend place where lepricorns come from! one US girl said this to an irish girl on a train to poland. She didnt belive she was from ireland cos she thought it was make believe hahah) Try to be alot more like Canadians, they are the people u should aspire to be! very likeable. Know that anything u can do Germans and brits and Japanese can do better! U dont have the best spec ops. No where near it! Probably one of the worst actually! Oh by the way im from 4RAR (4th royal australian regiment, (Commando force)) So yes i know about selections and spec forces. U could say we are a lil like ur rangers cross BUD/s and British SBS but admitingly not as good as the British SBS. I made SAS selection but chose to be in reserves 1st commando regiment 2 company before i went to fulltime in 4RAR. Oh by the way FACT….. ur SEALS selections was copied from AUSTRALIA’s selection for commando’s which is only half the selection of the SAS requirements in duration and timed runs and swims etc. So while u go on about that crap there is another thing u dont know cos u guys arnt interested. U think uve got it all. In Russia, if u try out for the spetznats and i should say made to try out, U would be lucky to come out at all. u learn to eat humans (smart when u think about it, I know of some Aussie SAS operators who found an aljazeera media team on there way to an american HQ and were stopped by our diggers. Must have been low on suppies and a resupply drop was not the cards. YUM YUM but if thats what it takes then thats what it takes), u get beaten constantly. But Russian Spetznatz are trained to be on the border of professionals and pyscopaths. Dont have the inteligence for what really maters. they seem to think there officers do that job. Anyway i think ive said enough. Oh and another thing . If u want to know what makes the best when it comes to miltary and its special ops?? Its not just that Australia has the most atheletes php when america has the fatest. Its environment. We are renowned by all spec ops as the best in guerilla warfare and jungle warefare. But we have the harshest deserts in the world to train in. We have the largest amount of water to cover e.g Indian ocean and pacific and antartic. We are all allone down here. so we are forced to be the best. So that covers the environments of jungle, ocean, Deserts but what about nautic. We dont have much snowy mountain regions here. hmmm but guess what? We are in charge militarily of Antartica. The 4 harshest environments in the world. Plus the most athletes plus we are diggers not soldiers. Plus we fight every war and its never our own. Plus we dont talk about our ops or make movies from them and bullshit the whole lot. Oh and we have the biggest urban mock up in Swanbourne for CQB and anti- terrorrsm in Swanbourne Western Australia in the world. Yes the biggest and the best. And because we ony have 60,000 service people in our defence forces. Our regular army is as good as ur rangers and clearnce divers are as good as ur SEALS and our special ops are still teaching u what to do when u lose ur hi tech comms and fancy dancy equipment, because when the shit hits the fan baby and uve lost all ur kit, its all about the soldier and training and professinalism. Im sorry but u guys haven’t earned ur respect from us cause uve f—cked up too many times as ive listed above. For christ sakes our frigates are beating ur large ships in friendly fights. Its bloody emabarrasing when u have to convince u guys that u were blown out of the water 3 hours ago so why dont u have ur indicating lights on. U dont utilise ur technology properly. Effort should be put into training and enhancement of skills not fancy dancy new gadgets that cost a $billion dollars each. If we wanted nuclear weapons we could. We,ve got the largest store of uranium in the world. We use green power and coal here. We had nuclear tests here around the same time u did. Yes the brits stole scientists too dahh. But we choose not cos its not VIABLE!!! the best thing u guys can do is to grab all the knowledge from The British Military and the Israeli’s and study study study and implement implement implement. But get ur country into gear first u cant have respectable military if they are deriven from the fatest citizens a country from this planet has to offer. Pull ur heads in Wake up. and learn!!! stop ur movies that idolize urselves, become a humble culture. Nobody likes Wankers (jerks). Then maybe one day u guys can call urselves the best. But until then Keep on dreaming.
and remember…. WHO DARES WINS!
January 24th, 2007 at 3:00 am
hey DEEP C you gotta get out more!!!!!!
January 31st, 2007 at 12:06 pm
I AM GONNA MAKE THIS BRIEF, AND EDUCATE SOME OF THE MORE IGNORANT PEOPLE OUT THERE FIRST AND FOREMOST THE MARINES DO NOT HAVE THE LONGEST BASIC, THE ARMY DOES BUT ITS ONLY REQUIRED FOR THE INFANTRY SOLDIER THERES NO SENSE IN SENDING THOSE WITH HIGH TECH OR NON COMBAT ARMS JOBS THROUGH IT SO THEY DO THE 8 WEEK BASIC TRAINING BUT THE ARMY ‘S IS 16 WEEKS ENOUGH SAID ON THAT, NOW FOR SPEC OPS THE GREEN BERETS IS FAR ADVANCE BEYOND ANY OTHER BRANCH BECAUSE OF THEIR TRAINING REQUIREMENTS WHICH CONSIST OF TRAINING IN ALL TERRAINS NOT JUST 1 OR 2 LIKE OTHE BRANCHES ALSO THEY LEARN OTHER LANGUAGES,CULTURAL TRAINING,INTERAGENCY OPERATIONS,ADVANCED MEDICAL PROCEDURES ALSO MOST ADVANCED WEAPONS TRAINING ON U.S AND FOREIGN ,UNCONVENTIONAL WARFARE,ADVANCED COMMUNICATIONS,INTELLIGENCE,ENGINEER SPECIALIST. ALSO IF YOU WANNA DO SOME RESEARCH THE SEALS ARE THE MOST FAILED SPEC OPS UNIT THAT HAVE BEEN SAVED BY ARMY RANGERS AND SPECIAL FORCES BUT DONT BELIEVE ME FIND OUT FOR YOURSELF, SEALS ARE JUST A HOLLYWOOD PERCEPTION AND THE MARINES RECON IS NOTHING MORE THAN AN ARMY CALVARY SCOUT. REMEMBER DO THE RESEARCH CAUSE I DID I JUST FINSHED A PAPER ON IT FOR COLLEGE AND DELTA FORCE IS STEP ABOVE ALL OF THEM BUT THERE IS NOT ALOT OF INFO ABOUT THEM CAUSE THEY ARE SECRATIVE.
March 3rd, 2007 at 5:35 pm
Bloody hell you really stuck it up them JRYE.Please remember that each US service person has the same potential as any other in the world.I must say you did bring up LOTS of valid points. I was a ‘Patrol master’(I did not flatter myself so)so called in an (RFSU) Regional Force Surveillance Unit Australia, I have worked in other places in the world with British forces. So I have seen the vast scale of other nations forces, yes we as Austrlians are up there but as you said, our numbers will always mean we have to punch way above our wieght. Not all Aussies are outstanding opperators. However pound for pound we sure give a good account of ourselves but, expendible numbers, inexaustible logistics and enormous fire power is hard to beat in open warfare, even so historicaly Australian forces have preformed ecceptionaly well in these situations as have many other nations armies. In my research I have found that historicaly the US Navy is best at learning from its mistakes and taking action to solve the problems. We all must look criticaly and honestly at our performance. This is the only way to improve and save lives,DO WE?? Our so called leaders need to choose wisely,they dont have a good track record. We/you all need to keep the Bastards honest! Dont get caught up in BLIND patriotism this leads only to BLIND following stick to the facts. The lives of people on all sides depend on it. If anyone is going to make a film about anything, they need to keep in mind that if it has a historical context it becomes historical information. Future generations will not know the truth and that sure suits some in power all over the world. Be mindful.
June 13th, 2007 at 10:18 pm
scott, you’re a fuckstick first of all, second, Force Recon is waaaaaaaaaaaay harder than a fuckin cav. scout. Do they swim eight to ten miles in the ocean to their designation??? Do they do 10 mile runs with 130 pounds packs on their backs??? I can go on forever. Your oblivious to the omnipotence of a force recon ghost! Oh, and if the navy seals are hollywood glare then why don’t you stop talking shit and join a branch. JMO
June 13th, 2007 at 10:21 pm
oh, and who save the army 3 times on hamburger hill when the VC’s were killing them??? THE MARINES!!! Go do some research cause I have done mine! I am joing the 1st force recon after I pass BRC(Basic Recon Course) and I gaurantee I’ll make it with God on my side.
July 2nd, 2007 at 11:40 am
id just like to answer a few questions, ive been in three of the units ya’ll have been talking about, presently still in one and deployed. trained with the aussie guys 1st commandos in mosman(near sydney)in 1997, in the blue mountains and jumped with some of them out in womara(spelling) not far from adelade. research is great gives you guidelines and glimpses of the lifestyles but not a true feeling. as far as people who bounce around from units, could be about funding , schools, or the challenge –but i know the grass is always greener until you look back(changed branches as well)really have no idea how i ended up on this site but i did and started reading and was really intrigued at how deep some peoples convictions are on a subject, actually im truly baffled. i think ive pretty much trained in every climate and region of this world, probably worked with most of the people you ve talked about and them some. depolyed several times in support of oif/oef. you know when i got out the first time my dad asked me to count the number of friends i had in the military and then count how many i had on the outside. i only had 1 civilian friend. i figured it out that we do it for our “brothers”. most of us come to the communities to be with like minded people “type A” we argue and fight with each other from time to time-makes us tighter. but we wouldnt want to be any where else, thats why people leave the line , ship, or big army so we dont have to babysit, so we can be go getters without supervision and stay shooters, even we have to fly desks from time to time.happens to us all. to who ever submitted this find a true “operator” i really like seeing everyone use that word “nice”. but be careful we like everyone else have shitbags too. i recommend one that is retired , most of us dont like the unwarranted attention it brings plus if named as a source without approval from usasoc or socom , could be someones career. but mostly dont want the harrassment from our peers. suppose to have thick skins but peer pressure is a mf. there are numerous websites run by former members of each one of the organizations everyone has discussed usually you can get info they have posted and if you ask nice and arent a rude person on their site they can often give you glimpse into their lives and yes current members on active duty go on those sites as well , not just people who were going to do it but got hurt, are about to go do it, or knew someone who did, or whatever. i dont think a forum is a place to voice what you are going to do —just go ahead and do it, nobody cares , plus no one likes a badge hunter or a glory seeker—doesnt sit well in the business. its a real bummer to those of us who are in the business. never put anyone down because they dont do what you do, remember you chose your job and they chose theirs,doesnt mean you cant be confident , just not an ass. now as far as having a clue about what you are writing for a screenplay. authenticity is always better, but ive watched movies with very little and have still been entertaining(trust me ive watched some movies-anyone deployed knows what im talking about). i think you have find your target audience and then entertain them and think about what the future budget will become. if you really filmed what we do all day –that would make for a long movie.i think you need to find that fine line between accuracy and entertaining, unless you write for discovery or a&e.
July 3rd, 2007 at 11:31 pm
This is exactly what I expected to find out after reading the title t know. Thanks for informative article