On accents
We’re in the middle of casting the two lead roles for Ops. As I predicted, the audition scenes have now become gibberish to me. The only advantage to having them so fully etched in my brain is that when an actor makes an interesting choice for a line reading, I suddenly snap back and pay attention.
The two roles are written as Americans, but Jordan and I are both more than willing to change the backstories to accommodate Britons, Australians or other nationalities. After all, almost every country has soldiers. So in addition to hiring on New York and Los Angeles casting agents, Fox was generous enough to bring on casting directors in Sydney and London. We’re getting in new tapes every few days.
Unfortunately, the overseas casting agents aren’t taking us at our word. Almost every actor is trying an American accent.
Almost every attempt fails.
Here’s the thing: If you’re an Australian actor, you can probably suppress your give-away twang, just like most Canadians can — with a lot of effort — distinguish between “about” and “a boot.” But just because you don’t sound Australian, doesn’t mean you necessarily sound American. Often, this lack of accent is worse. We can hear that something’s not quite right, but we don’t know what it is. And while we’re wondering what’s wrong, we’ve lost track of your performance.
Now, obviously, there are some cases where an international actor will simply have to try for a specific American accent, just as an American actor may need to hit a certain British dialect. But if a producer or director tells you to use your natural accent, trust him. It’s not because you suck. It’s because you’re better when you can use every part of who you are.
As a side note, two actors we met with yesterday were Americans whom I’ve only seen play British. James Marsters and Alexis Denisof both come from the Buffy/Angel universe. It was jarring hearing them speak, because I kept expecting the same voices I’d heard for eight seasons or so. But even more interesting was recognizing the actors’ own cadences that were the same even without the accent; on a fundamental level, Spike sounds like James Marsters.
To me, it’s further proof that actors shouldn’t dwell so much on accents, but rather focus on giving the words meaning.
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December 1st, 2005 at 11:59 am
James Marsters is great! And I just assumed he was a Brit. I saw a couple of the Smallville eps he was in, and you’re right. He definitely has the same cadence despite the American (or actually Kryptonian) accent. I think he could fit the role. What was your impression of his read, or can you give us that?
Great stuff as always, John!
December 1st, 2005 at 1:52 pm
I know this is highly unconventional, unprofessional and un…eh…ineffective. But check this guy out: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1149087/ Most powerful screen performer since young Brando!
December 1st, 2005 at 2:00 pm
I have missed seeing James Marsters on my tv screen on a weekly basis. He is an exceptional actor and makes any production he is in better. That somebody will recognize his talent and give him a wonderful role in his own series is at the very top of my Christmas wish list.I am now very much looking forward to hearing more about “Op” as it goes along.
December 1st, 2005 at 2:06 pm
Johnny, I think you were right about the unconventional, unprofessional and un…eh…ineffective part. On a side note, I’ve yet to find a Canadian who says “aboot”. But, maybe I just haven’t looked hard enough.
December 1st, 2005 at 2:13 pm
JAMES MARSTERS!!!!! I’ve been watching him on Smallville. What presence and yeah even without the Brit accent, a voice so rich and deep it’ll melt your innards. Please tell me you’ll be putting him on my screen on a weekly basis. I may have to give my first born or scarafice a goat or two.
December 1st, 2005 at 2:35 pm
Taylor: I hear ya… But this guy is good! Sometimes you gotta break the rules and aim for the long shot.
December 1st, 2005 at 2:38 pm
You auditioned James and Alexis?! Lucky you. They are magnificent actors.
December 1st, 2005 at 2:41 pm
Anthony Lapaglia was reduced to lying in auditions and saying he was born in Brooklyn at one stage.
December 1st, 2005 at 3:12 pm
James Marsters is an amazing actor. Can turn on a dime from comedy to drama and back again. The only other actor I’ve ever seen who’s that good is Ron Perlman (”Beauty and the Beast”).
December 1st, 2005 at 4:46 pm
Great post John. I remember seeing an interview with Radha Mitchell where she spoke with an American accent even when not auditioning, so she got halfway through filming before anyone realised she was Australian.
Definitely is weird seeing an actor use his real accent when you’ve only ever seen his fake one. When I saw Serenity, I had only ever seen Alan Tudyk as Wat in A Knight’s Tale, where he played a fantastic Brit. In fact, I was so convinced he was a Brit, I thought his (real) American accent was a bit fake!
December 1st, 2005 at 5:46 pm
“about.”
jackass.
December 1st, 2005 at 6:58 pm
yeah, yeah, yeah…
December 1st, 2005 at 6:59 pm
yeah, yeah, yeah…
What are James and Alex like in actual life?
December 1st, 2005 at 8:55 pm
Hey, John. I am a long-time fan of yours and I dont think I have ever been disappointed in anything you have ever said, until now.
First you make an extreme comment about Canadians. I do not know of any Canadians who say ‘A Boot’. And the closest I have heard to it are those from the maratimes. To go further, Canadians, once they understand the extremely subtle differences in accent, are able to easily pull a convincing American accent. Case-in-point. A person from Toronto will say “Dollar,” while a person from Detroit will say something more akin to “Daller.” And in terms of that, even Americans usually don’t notice these things.
There are many successful news anchors in America, for example, that are actually Canadian. The most famous being the late, great Peter Jennings. But I can say for sure that unless told that he was Canadian, most people would just take him for any other American anchor.
Another thing is that you seem to be saying that it is almost impossible for a Briton to pull off an American accent, but what about Hugh Laurie on House? He pulls off an accent that is probably better that most Americans. And if he can do it, I am sure there are many others that can aswell. There are many actors like Nicole Kidman or Russell Crowe who often do American accents quite well too.
I just needed to get that off my chest.
December 1st, 2005 at 10:06 pm
Ben Kingsley’s real name is Krishna Bhanji.
December 1st, 2005 at 10:32 pm
Well, just to point out that Smallville is having its best ratings ever, and why? Because many thousands of Marsters fans are watching just for the occasional glimpse of one of the best actors on TV.
JM comes complete with a huge and loyal fanbase (that also loves Alexis) that will immediately give any TV show a boost. Just a thought. Not trying to suggest anything.
December 2nd, 2005 at 2:13 am
I agree with what the writer says above, which makes it even more galling to have to listen to Americans going on and on about how “I never even knew James wasn’t British”. Well that’s because you’re ignorant. I have nothing against James Marsters. I really enjoyed his portrayal of Spike. But his British accent is all over the place, and yet he’s treated as some sort of acting god. Not only is it annoying if you are British, but it kind of makes James look a bit foolish, which I’m sure he’s not. Yet it seems that when an American is distracted by a non-American botching their dialect, this is somehow cause for complaint.
Yeah, and Anthony Stewart Head’s from Lithuania, you idiots!:)
December 2nd, 2005 at 3:40 am
Any time I see an unknown somebody pushing an unkown actor as the “most powerful actor since…”, I tend to wonder how closely related they are, or how many days the latter did to the former’s student film.
December 2nd, 2005 at 4:37 am
Bad accents don’t just distract me, they annoy me a lot. Even a show like Lost, which I love, annoys me when they have an actress playing ‘the crazy French chick’ who can’t even speak French with a French accent. I tried very hard to watch Elijah Wood’s ‘Green Street Hooligans’ but had to give up after ten minutes because an American actor was trying to play a Brit and couldn’t keep his accent nailed down for more than two words at a time. It’s lazy and it’s an insult to the audience that they think we won’t realise. It’s not like there’s a shortage of actors of every nationality available… Hurrah for John August for rejecting this nincompoopery.
December 2nd, 2005 at 4:49 am
I once made a big mistake directing an actress… she came into the read like a whirlwind, energy all over the place, incredibly spontaneous and natural. And wonderfully Irish. The problem was that I knew the producer would probably nix her because our star had just come out of a long-running and successful show with an Irish setting, and so I asked her to tape with an English accent. Which she did, perfectly. He saw the tape and she landed the role.
My mistake was that I’d locked her into a situation where a percentage of her creativity was always going to be diverted into maintaining the accent, and I never again saw the explosiveness that had so impressed me at the outset. My fault, my inexperience. And thanks to me she didn’t get to make as strong an impression as she deserved.
December 2nd, 2005 at 9:43 am
pissed off canadian:
“About” and “a boot” is an extreme example, but having shot two TV shows in Canada, I can promise you that one has to be hyper-vigilant if the character is supposed to be American. A Canadian accent isn’t wrong. It isn’t bad. But it exists, even if you swear it doesn’t.
Some things honestly sound better. I’ll take “sorry” over the American “sawry” anyday. Unless the character is supposed to be American.
December 2nd, 2005 at 10:28 am
Watching a new set of British tapes last night, I found two actors who did very convincing accents. One went for Brooklyn, the other went for Californian (or whatever you want to call how Keanu Reeves speaks).
Here was the giveaway: “And suddenly it’s a toll road.”
The British actors pretty consistantly rhymed “toll” with “doll,” whereas we would rhyme it with “hole.”
December 2nd, 2005 at 11:08 am
Accents are very hard to deal with.
I directed a movie entitled, Serial. The movie was supposed to take place in a small town in upstate NY and I ended up hiring a wonderful British actress as one of the police officers. She’s a great actress who’s starred alongside Kate Beckinsale, Kate Hudson, and now Audrey Tatou. But her talent relies on her wonderfully gorgeous idiosyncrasies, not her accent. During filming we realized that we were going to have to have her come back and do some ADR to fix the weird accent. And guess what? Her accent during ADR sounds exactly the same!
I think the problem deals mainly with producers who believe that if you film a movie in America, everybody should be American. The only actor I know who’s been able to get around this is Hugh Grant. Everybody else just sounds like Bob Hoskins (His American accent is hilarious). Accents are a tricky thing. Even for accomplished actors. Don Cheadle’s accent in Hotel Rwanda was very good. But his accent in Ocean’s Eleven (and Twelve) is atrocious.
My advice? Always keep their native accent. And when they say they can change it, don’t believe it. Unless it’s Meryl Streep.
December 2nd, 2005 at 11:37 am
I personally would love to see James Marsters as a lead in this show. He’s got a magnifent presence and has gotten great critical acclaim.
December 2nd, 2005 at 11:38 am
I’m a huge James Marsters fan and I started watching Smallville because of his recurring role. As an Anglophile, I was surprised JM wasn’t English. After years of watching Masterpiece Theatre I was sure I could spot a phony Brit accent immediately.
Here’s hoping James (and Alexis) are cast in this pilot.
December 2nd, 2005 at 11:40 am
“Unfortunately, the overseas casting agents aren’t taking us at our word. Almost every actor is trying an American accent.”
I find that extremely strange. In fact I’m tempted to think that said agents didn’t have the presence of mind to inform the actors that they’re not required to try to sound American. I know actors who are regularly asked to audition and rarely are they flown to wherever their agents are based (like London). A lot of the time they just get sent the sides (or whatever it’s called) and have to make the tapes themselves. I think Hugh Laurie auditioned for House this way; he was on location at the time, working.
But that aside, you must be having a very good time! I heartily envy you. But this must be a tad nerve wrecking too because not only do you need two actors who are ‘right’ for the roles, they also have to complement each other.
I doubt I’d watch House if it weren’t for Hugh Laurie. I’ve seen him in a lot of shows but comedy only - ranging from broad to mildly amusing. It never ceases to amaze me to see him in this kind of role (not to mention his being able to maintain the believable accent). I don’t know if I’d watch Veronica Mars if it weren’t for the great and nicely complementary casting of the father-daughter roles. And I’ve never been able to sit through an entire Joan of Arcadia (sp?) ep because the lead teen character is so generic, both in terms of looks and acting. Well, so it seems to me. Perhaps the show was brilliantly written, I just never managed to get past this actress. I don’t think I’d be able to pick her out from a group of 20 actresses of similar age, all with straight long dark hair and small unformed features. Okay, she’s pretty but pretty isn’t enough.
December 2nd, 2005 at 12:38 pm
Oh Marsters’ British accent was truly awful. Why anyone could find it convincing is beyond me?
Still if we’re talking about North Americans doing British accents the members of Spinal tap acquit themselves rather well. True Bruno Kirby does slip the odd time but Guest and McKean could easily pass for Londoners.
December 2nd, 2005 at 1:46 pm
As a native I can attest that David Anders does pretty good Brit as Julian Sark in ALIAS. How do American find Jamie Bamber in BATTLESTAR GALACTICA? Or Adrian Lester in THE WEST WING?
December 2nd, 2005 at 1:48 pm
I am so excited to hear that you met with James Marsters and Alexis Denisof. James is an amazing actor who brings so much to every role he plays and, as mentioned in an earlier post, his performance on Smallville this season has increased viewership quite a bit. He is an amazing actor and would be a huge asset to any show he was cast in. Alex is no slouch himself. He is a wonderful actor and I was surprised to find that he didn’t have a british accent. I know he lived in Britian for a time which I’m sure helped. I really hope you give serious thought to casting them in Ops.
December 2nd, 2005 at 2:22 pm
I’m really looking forward to more posts from this side of the writing world… wait, is Canada included in the writing world? Hmmm.
December 2nd, 2005 at 2:39 pm
I had no idea Jamie Bamber wasn’t American, so he must be doing pretty good job! Reading his bio, his dad was American, so maybe that’s one reason he does so well with the accent.
Thanks for the tidbits on Marsters and Denisof. I’d give a lot to see either of them (but especially da Marsters:) on my small screen regularly again.
December 2nd, 2005 at 3:02 pm
Doug: Indeed I have worked with Heger. Otherwise I wouldn’t recommend him, would I? However it was not on a student shoot but on the William H. Macy WWII drama IN ENEMY HANDS (I did a dialogue polish and Rene had a leading role).
December 2nd, 2005 at 4:41 pm
re: Jamie Bamber’s accent on GALACTICA. To my ear, it’s essentially flawless — but almost too flawless, maybe a little overenunciated. He does not sound to me like he’s “doing an accent,” but it does make him come off as a little too intense even when he’s supposed to be speaking very casually or flippantly. But for me, at least, I think that ultimately helps lend some perhaps-unintended-but-not-inconsistent texture to his characterization. It reminds me of a guy I went to high school with, actually.
December 2nd, 2005 at 6:13 pm
I don’t watch Battlestar Galactica, which is by all I’ve heard, great.
But it’s an interesting thing with accents in science-fiction, since there’s realistically no reason why a bunch of people in space should have American accents. I guess it’s the same reason why everthing that takes place in the past has British accents (c.f. Rome).
History belongs to Britain; the future belongs to America.
(And yes, I’m aware that Battlestar Galactica is not necessarily set in the future.)
December 2nd, 2005 at 6:38 pm
I’m finding this discussion of accents fascinating. Judgments about whether an accent is good or bad may be due to the preconceived ideas of the listener. As someone who has lived in Philadelphia, New York, Georgia, and Maine, I would be hard pressed to say what a true American accent is. As an aside, The Guardian published an article this year listing which actors had the most convincing artificial accents. James Marsters was in the top ten.
December 2nd, 2005 at 7:05 pm
Sorry Mik (and others?) - as a Brit, I have to disagree with your views about James Marsters’ accent. I thought froma bout the middle of the series, he had succeeded in the trick of using one accent overlaying a natural upper class English accent. This allowed him to play all sorts of games with the fake Spike accent while using the “true” accent for the emotionally honest scenes. Very deliberate and very clever. And without foreknowledge, I would never have placed him as anything other than British - and never as an American.
December 2nd, 2005 at 7:20 pm
Accents are tricky things. I know in my head I still sound British but after 5 years in the US people back home have noticed slight changes here and there. The thing that usually irritates me with the US actors playing British is the tendency to go incredibly posh. I thought Rene Zelwegger was great in Bridget Jones but that accent is pretty much unheard of outside of royalty. I did assume Marsters was English when I first saw Buffy though there are moments when it wasn’t so good too, it depends what episodes and how much attention your paying as well.
I like that your open to a wide range of actors in these roles. It would seem to me that accent would come fairly low down the list of essentials when casting though I guess they’d have to be intelligable to the average US audience come what may. Didn’t Jane Leeves have to alter her accent to make it more stereotypically English so she could be understood in Frasier?
Anyway, thanks for the post and good luck with finding your ideal actors.
December 2nd, 2005 at 8:07 pm
I’m so excited to learn that James Marsters tried out for a part in this project. I’m a big fan of his.
December 3rd, 2005 at 2:15 am
Nice observation about sci-fi usually having American accents and history always having British accents. Another thing I find amusing is when one accent doubles for another — for example, a British accent doubling as a German one (as with the lead villains in “Die Hard” and “Die Hard With a Vengeance,” unless they used German accents and my memory is just faulty). I’m sure there are many more examples of this as well.
December 3rd, 2005 at 7:27 am
About accents, I don’t know about anyone else, but moving from place to place, my accent is very mixed up and I tend to take on bits of the accent of the area I’ve lived in last (If I’ve been there for any amount of time). IMO, there’s no set accent, particularly if you’ve lived everywhere like I have.
December 3rd, 2005 at 3:13 pm
Let me cast a vote for Alexis (as if our begging and pleading will have any effect). He is an amazing actor, and personally I thought he out shined everyone else on both Buffy and Angel (although to be fair he was goven much more to work with then the others). James MArsters is good, but he will always be Spike, he owned that role. Alexis is still fresh enough to take on other roles without having all of that baggage.
December 3rd, 2005 at 5:08 pm
James Marsters is an exceptional actor, with amazing screen presence, with or without a British accent, (I’m British BTW). And such is his versatility, that recently he went from playing a genius super villain on Smallville to playing Macbeth on the London stage, and then on to film a feature thriller. Whatever role he takes on is totally believable, whatever production he’s in is always the better for having him there. I hope you give serious consideration to casting him in ‘Ops’. I think he would be a great asset. Alexis, is a terrific actor too, I hope we see him regularly on TV again soon.
December 3rd, 2005 at 5:24 pm
The most jarring accent redux I’ve ever encountered was meeting Damian Lewis (more well known as “Major Winters” from Band of Brothers). I had absolutely thought he was American. But low and behold he was another Brit sweeping in and nailing an American accent… that didn’t sound like John Wayne, or a drunken New Yorker.
Anyway, some can do it. Some can’t. But when they do, man it throws you.
December 3rd, 2005 at 9:31 pm
Back to the Canadian comment. Obviously there are subtle differences between American and Canadian accents, but only in so much as there are sublte differences between a New Yorker’s accent, a Bostonian’s accent, a Mid-Westerner’s accent, someone from the West-Coast’s accent, someone from the South’s accent, etc. Someone brought up the fact that there are many Canadian reporters that are working in the US, such as the late Peter Jennings, who most Americans would have never guessed was originally from Canada. Similarly, there is a countless number of Canadian actors who are prospering in US television using their own real accents. Many of those shows and movies that they star in are even being filmed in places such as Vancouver, Toronto and Montreal.
My 2 cents.
December 4th, 2005 at 1:26 am
It’s will be wonreful if James ana Alexis could play in this project together. And don’t listen those, who says that James always will be Spike. He great and awesome actor, who could play various characters, which could be completly different from Spike. I see this characters and I never thougth “Oh, he is exactly like Spike” Instead I was fascinated how real and touching this people was, everyone with his own life, destiny, views and feelings.
December 4th, 2005 at 4:19 am
It’s difficult for us Australians to tell if our Aussie actors are pulling off a credible American accent. Perhaps those Americans reading this can tell us what they think of the following Australian actors doing American dialect: Hugo Weaving, Naomi Watts, Nicole Kidman, Russell Crowe (okay he was born in NZ), Heath Ledger, Anthony LaPaglia, Hugh Jackman, Radha Mitchell, Julian MacMahon, Cate Blanchett, Geoffrey Rush, Noah Taylor, Judy Davis, and Simon Baker for starters. I’m sure there are others but that’ll do for now.
December 4th, 2005 at 6:23 am
Some interesting points made. As a Brit (more specifically a Scot living in England so possibly more used to picking accents apart to understand the sassanachs
I found James Marsters English accent to be very spotty but a good attempt and acceptable considering the character requirements (he was very old and had moved around considerably which in reality would have a fairly profound affect on accent). I must confess I feel more Brits (to my ear at least) nail an American accent than vice versa. As someone mentioned, Jamie Bamber seems to do a pretty good job as does Colin Farrell, Damian Lewis, Hugh Laurie etc. From the other side of the pond Gwyneth Paltrow, Angelina Jolie (too generic to be real but fairly convincing) and Alexis Denisof have been pretty good (in fact I thought Denisof was British until I heard his normal sort of mid-Atlantic voice in interview - the few slight mistakes he made could be accounted for by a Brit living in the US). Most actors seem to go for a posh English accent basically because it’s easier to do and conforms more to foreign expectations of Englishness thanks to the BBC’s adoption of RP (see Josh Hartnett’s ‘yorkshire’ or Dick Van Dyke’s ‘cockney’ for what can happen when regional accents are tried).
Not to turn this into a slagging match but Mel Gibson’s Scots accent in Braveheart was pretty embarrassing along with Brad Pitt and Tom Cruise’s ‘oirish’ attempts.
December 4th, 2005 at 7:14 am
As an aside, The Guardian published an article this year listing which actors had the most convincing artificial accents. James Marsters was in the top ten.
I was amused at their list of the bad. Dick Van Dyke will live in infamy for his accent in Mary Poppins.
http://film.guardian.co.uk/features/featurepages/0,,1451821,00.html
December 4th, 2005 at 9:26 am
One of the little-noticed masters of accents has to be FAMILY GUY’s Seth McFarlane… when you get idiot lead character Peter Griffin, urbane Brian the dog, and fey-Brit baby Stewie Griffin all in the same scene, the last thing you think of is that it’s all the one artist.
December 4th, 2005 at 9:30 am
I’d like to see Page Kennedy as one of the leads.
Here’s an actor with no baggage to speak of.
December 5th, 2005 at 4:22 am
As much as I loved watching James Marsters and Alexis Denisof in Buffy and Angel, neither of them have a good British accent. They have a good stereotypical english accent. As a Brit I find myself just sighing and then getting on with it… in the same way most Scots do if they watch Mel Gibson in Braveheart - it’s passable Scottish to me - very poor to anyone Scottish.
Having said that, I remember when we cast for a game I developed 10 years back - most of the parts that required a particular accent were not given to native speakers but to people putting the accent on - otherwise the accent was not pronounced enough! It’s all about stereotypes…
December 5th, 2005 at 5:05 am
The Guardian piece was one man’s opinion. One man who works in California. I think the problem is that one gets inured to the accent until you just accept it as Spike. But “Deliberate and Clever”? Please. At least Denisof sounds consistently like a Brit who’s been living in America.
December 5th, 2005 at 12:32 pm
I always thought Canadians actually pronounced “about” (however not aboot) the way it was written while us Americans say it like, “abowt”.
As far as Marsters and Denisof, they were both spotty at times though in a sense it fit with the characters as Spike changed his accent upon becoming a vampire and then moved about for a century and then Wesley had been in the States for a few years. However I have to admit that I could barely tell Wesley had an accent the first few episodes he was in whether it be that he tends to whisper or what, plus the way he drags the tail of a word on. Of course Marsters particularly in the beginning was a bit off. But the British actor who portrayed a vilian on “Angel” was surprised Marsters wasn’t a Brit, so make up your own mind.
I think they are both great actors with Marsters a bit bit above, but either way both have a great fanbase and althought hey equally may be known as Spike and Wesley, either one of them, I think, could pull something like this off.
December 5th, 2005 at 12:42 pm
I’m a Brit and am amazed at how often I have to inform fellow Brits that James Marsters isn’t British ( Or blond or 25) So it seems to me that he did a good job. The accent isn’t flawless but sounds like exactly what it’s meant to be, a posh kid playing tough and adopting a North London accent to go with his new persona.
Alexis and James would be a dream team in terms of casting ( pretty please)
December 5th, 2005 at 12:55 pm
I’m English and I agree that when James Marsters first took on the role of Spike I knew his accent was fake. But I still thought he was English. As a poster above very accurately mentioned he has the base accent down and plays with the regional aspects.
Also, having seen him in a variety of roles from Spike and Milton Fine, to his sweet priest in North Exposure and war veteran in Millennium, to his recent and powerful Macbeth I can most definitely say he is no on-trick pony.
I like Alexis Denisof a great deal but I think to compare their two accents is misleading slighty. Perhpas is James had lived in England for 15 years his accent would have please even the most critical of ears.
Either way I’m excited that both wonderful actors are connected with this project. Fingers crossed for the outcome.
December 5th, 2005 at 2:24 pm
“…having shot two TV shows in Canada, I can promise you that one has to be hyper-vigilant if the character is supposed to be American.”
Having lived in Canada all my life, I can promise you that it takes us zero effort to ‘…distinguish between “aboutâ€? and “a boot.â€?’, mostly because (a) we don’t actually say ‘aboot’ and (b) we are not total idiots.
Maia Sepp (Toronto)
December 6th, 2005 at 12:31 am
Yes, it takes great effort for me to not say “aboot”.
cough
Though having shot two shows in Canada…wow. I guess that makes you an expert on our accents.
December 6th, 2005 at 10:41 am
But can we hear our own accents? I’m a midwesterner and swore that we didn’t have an accent, until a linguistics prof made me say, “Marry, merry, Mary.” Midwesterners pronounce them all identically.
To the American ear, many Canadians do say “aboot”. But since many Minnesotans also say “aboot”, I suspect it’s not Canadian but rather from that central region where there are many of Scandinavian descent.
So Maia in Toronto might very well say “ab-out”, while someone from Winnipeg might say “aboot”. Canada is a very big country!
December 6th, 2005 at 2:46 pm
Being Canadian, I figured I should throw in my 1.73 cents.
In my junior level linguistics course (ok, so I’m not an expert), we learned about “Canadian raising.” Essentially, when certain dipthongs come before unvoiced consonants, the tongue is slightly raised in the mouth. An American would pronounce the vowel sounds in “aloud” and “about” the same - sort of an “ow” sound. In Canadian English, the words have two different vowel sounds - “ow” for “aloud” and something like “uh-oo” for “about”. This latter sound is not used in American English, so the closest approximation Americans can make is “aboot.” The same thing happens with the “ay” sound in “eyes” and “ice” - in American it’s “ayz” and “ays”, in Canadian it’s “ayz” and “uhys.”
December 7th, 2005 at 4:20 pm
Alexis and James…I would love to see more of those guys-mainly Alexis. I like to hear them using the accents they used on Buffy and Angel. In their American natural accents-I don’t find them as compelling to watch and listen to. But I might be compelled to watch if there’s non-gratuitous nudity that’s essential to the story. Especially of Alexis. Buffy and Angel have pushed the envelope of broadcast network tv Spike nudity. So if you do get a chance to work with them…let them use the fake accents. Spike was hot during Buffy, Wes was very hot during Angel. and I do prefer Spike to real James, and Wes to real Alexis-because of the accents.
December 13th, 2005 at 10:32 pm
Is there a reason that the casting is taking place ahead of the “regular” pilot season? And who is handling the NY casting?
December 26th, 2005 at 10:35 pm
Ok… firstly, Alan Tudyk isn’t a brit?! I’m shocked lol Here’s another one for you then: Same film (A Knight’s tale), Mark Addy. He’s from the same city as me in Northern UK so his natural accent is as in “The Full Monty” but he plays an american in “still standing” over there which I’ve heard is phenomenal. I’ve not had chance to see it yet, anyone on here watch it/seen it?
I studied acting before deciding I would rather write and that posh accent or ‘queen’s english’ that most internationals learn to speak when trying to be Brit (or that Brit’s acting abroad tend to speak) is called Received Pronunciation (RP). You get it drummed into you… It’s supposed to be a bit like wearing no make-up and a pony-tail for an audition; a clean slate of none accent to work from. Only it really sucks at it’s job and is now just seen as snobbish, they even call it BBC English these days because the name “Received Pronunciation” apparently has some elitist connotations lol
Poor Kate Winslet is northern too… comes from about 30 miles away but she had to ’strip’ her accent and learn RP at drama school. I’d give anything to see if she still talks like my mates after a few pints of lager and a bag of peanuts!
I think at the end of the day, a lot of actors really are shit with accents. I’m surprised at what passes for a good attempt from all sides of the pond and I’m beginning to think that the only true masters of vocal chords are the comedians! Someone else hit the nail on the head too — it’s also in the ear of the beholder and the expectations of hearing a certain dialect/accent that may in themselves be entirely wrong.
My first ever audition was for a part in a short film made by a former bafta nominee. I was 16 and stupid so I went in guns blazing with a wonderful Tennessee hairdresser’s monologue lol I got the part so I can’t have been that bad! and the reason given? The director, a fun guy called Lance, was fucking sick of sitting through really bad versions of Shakespeare. Musta been very strange to hear someone suddenly blurting out an accent like that in Nottingham on a Tuesday morning hehe Of course, now I’m older and ‘wiser’ I’d have gone in with Shakespeare and RP… I’d never have got the part!
I wonder if anyone did anything weird through naievity or stupidity for your auditions John?
x
December 26th, 2005 at 10:39 pm
naivety ffs it’s 5:38am. I sleep now.
lol
February 1st, 2006 at 9:11 am
Me and my friend had an arguement about Kate Beckinsale last night, he says she is at least 39 and I think she is in her early 30s. We have been looking for the correct answer and found your blog in the search engine results, could you please tell us her exact age?
Great blog.
Steve & Chris.
February 28th, 2006 at 8:50 am
Re accents - I think JM’s english accent was OK, Im prepared to accept he really was trying to mix it up but he veered between dick van dyke and Olivier’s Henry V at times (even in the same episode) so….perhaps that stretches the credibility of that a little. Alexis Denishof just made me want to pee my pants his accent was so terrible, it got better in Angel but OMG the stuff in Buffy was painful to watch. When are US casting people going to realise that all British people are not like Hugh Grant. Denishof played Wesley as Hugh Grant’s even more of an upper class twit brother, even more than tim nice-but-dim - awful…and as even Hugh Grant ‘upper class twits it up’…well words cant describe… I have lived here all my life and I have NEVER met anyone like Hugh Grant!! LOL Anyway…The worst of the worst accents to me are always IRISH - Angel’s Irish oh dear. My bloke is Irish and he just cant bear to listen to it, even worse that Tom (y’re a corker) Cruise. Please cast Irish people to do Irish roles as otherwise my TV is in danger of being chucked out the window!
March 6th, 2006 at 2:32 am
I’m more than a little late in on this discussion, but what the hey.
As for Jamie Bamber: I watch Battlestar Galactica a lot and I was stunned when I put on a DVD of the BBC/A&E production of Horatio Hornblower and saw him speaking in a British accent. It’s astonishing, really. Usually you can at least sort of tell. I had to look it up. His American accent, I think, is completely flawless. The past belonging to the British/the future belonging to the Americans may be a valid point, but the specific reason for Jamie Bamber’s fake accent is that he plays the son of Edward James Olmos’ character, and I presume they’d rather have Olmos’ natural voice than Bamber’s, for obvious reasons.
There have however been several situations in which a British or otherwise actor or actress really hurt a performance by completely failing to do an American accent. The one that comes to mind most immediately is the recent Cameron Crowe film “Elizabethtown”, in which Orlando Bloom failed so completely miserably to do an American accent in a film about middle American culture, it was physically painful to watch.
A few in response to the Australian actor list:
Hugo Weaving - The only movie I’ve seen in which he did something resembling an American accent was The Matrix (which was shot in Sydney, ironically enough), but his voice was so weird for other reasons I wouldn’t notice one way or another. He sounded odd, but I don’t think that’s because he did the accent badly. I just think his character’s voice was odd. So I bought it for that reason at least.
Naomi Watts - Had no idea she was Australian. So apparently she’s doing it well.
Nicole Kidman - She jumps around accents a lot in different roles, so it’s difficult to separate all the noise, but if I remember correctly she does it alright.
Russell Crowe - I wouldn’t call it bad, but it is noticeable.
Heath Ledger - I thought he did it poorly until I saw Brokeback Mountain. He seemed to improve — or maybe he does the rural southern thing better than the “neutral” midwestern standard.
And as for Canadian accents:
I’m from the Chicago area, and I can’t tell the difference between someone from Toronto and someone from Chicago. But I can pick someone from Nova Scotia right out of a noisy crowd. The Scarborough accent is also very, very distinct. Mike Myers’ accent is really recognizeably different from the Midwestern USA accent. I don’t think there’s a national divide as much as there is a regional one, or even a city/rural one, just like in the US. Though I will say, you’d have to do some pretty serious accent training to get someone from Canada to play someone from anywhere south of St. Louis. I think most of all it’s a north/south thing.
October 6th, 2006 at 5:28 pm
I will forget about the stereotypes that Canadians say “eh”…I mean you can even buy a t-shirt saying “CANADA EH”!
I have lived and worked in Canada and it sounds more like “Aboat” (Irish) instead of “aboot” - Aboot is more Scottish! (Hence Nova Scotia). But i heard a few “Oats and Aboots”, but mainly the further east like Ontario. It is usually O’s and A’s! - But Howdy ya’all is a Texan thing!!!! that’s for sure. Also some say “Ruff” instead of “Roof”. In Texas people pronounce Toyota…”teayota”! BUT FROM TRAVELLING EXPERIENCE -The further west i travel i find the accent more Americanized such as “prah-cess” instead of some would say “process” as a British would say.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NK92rcZW0OM
Check that site out and there is an “ABOOT” in it. Oh! and my username is Supersmooth007 so check out my videos! (Canadian fag).
October 6th, 2006 at 5:31 pm
Ruff is American way of saying roof!
April 21st, 2007 at 7:26 pm
To the Australian:
I love Julian McMahon but … his accent is extremely flawed. When I watch Charmed, I hear him slip constantly, like in almost every sentence. The last episode I watched, he added an “r” to the end of a word ending in “a”. Only New Englanders do that in America, but it’s a very common Ango-Australian thing.
He also messes up with his Australian “o’s”: e.g. “So” often sounds like an Australian “Soh-ee”.
I have finally managed to distinguish between NZ and Aus accents. To an Australian, that must be an easy thing, but to your ear, that’s the difference between a Canadian and U.S. accent, I’d imaging. You have to learn how to distinguish the two.
I have often thought that like the Canadian Accent, Australia’s is fairly uniform throughout the whole country. Is that so?
I’m a Canadian living in the U.S. for a long time now (>10 years). The person who commented on Canadian Raising is dead-on, and I’ve read, and noticed, the same phenomena that he speaks of.
I am keenly aware of all the Canadian give-aways, and I can pass 99% of the time. A small number of people claim they can tell ONCE I TELL THEM, but no one has ever “accused” me of it ;-). Most people are NOT very attuned to accents, I’ve noticed.
Most Canadians think they have no accent, or that they have a “Mid-Western New Anchor’s” accent. Living in Philadelphia, I can say that that’s a joke. BTW, the “Philadelphia” accent is awful. I try NOT to emulate it, except for fun. No offense to any Philadelphian or Canadians.
Beyond pronunciation, To my ear, Canadian speech has a very stilted cadence that is quite different from most American speech patterns.
There is certain vocabulary that Canadians use, but Americans do not. Those are easily altered. Examples: elastics [rubber bands], pop [soda] (depending on part of U.S.), standard [stick] (as in a car’s transmission), eavestrough [gutter], collector lanes [express lanes], and many more.
I watch a lot of SciFi Channel, and a huge number of shows are shot in Canada, and my American friend and I make a sport of spotting the Canadian actors. It’s easy and especially easy if you’ve had some distance from it, by living in the U.S. Likewise with Smallville. Kristin Kreuk is not even trying to cover hers up. Erika Durance is better, but she trips up on her flat “a’s”. I have some trouble with those too (e.g. “bad”->bahd instead of bay-ad, “that”->thaht instead of they-at, etc…). I can definitely make those words sound American if I try, and I know how to, but if I’m lazy or not paying attention, that’s where I will invariably trip up too, and I can HEAR myself doing so at this point.
Here are my most noticed Canadian tells: Yeah, About, Out, Right, Light, Not, No, Eh [too obvious], Know, bad, that, etc…
My personal theory is that the Canadian accent is totally a descendent of the Scottish Accent; whereas, the American accent is a descendent of the Irish Accent.
We all know that Minnesota’s accent descends from Scandanavian immigrants. There are some overlapping sounds between it and the Canadian accent, but I think it’s more coincidental than a true population overlap.
Lastly, like with all accents, within a single family, or city, you’ll find an extremely large range of relative strengths of the regional accent, and Canada is no different in this regard.
As far as Peter Jennings goes, he never [and proudly so] even tried to alter his Canadian accent, and it was always quite evident to me.
One last point: I have heard many older Canadians suggest that younger Canadians are sounding more and more “American” all the time to their ears due to TV. PERHAPS. I’ve noticed this a little bit, but there’s ALWAYS a giveaway or several.
June 13th, 2007 at 4:49 pm
Re post above…Kate Winslet is from Reading! Quite a bit below the Watford Gap. NOT from the North.
July 11th, 2007 at 6:09 pm
Yeah, I agree with some earlier posters about other people’s interpretations of your accents. I’m from DC/Metro area, and didn’t think I had any type of accent at all until I went on vacation and said “you all”. I thought I had CLEARLY said “you all” but everybody else swore I said “y’all”.