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	<title>Comments on: Race and the screenwriter</title>
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	<link>http://johnaugust.com/archives/2006/race-and-the-screenwriter</link>
	<description>A ton of useful information about screenwriting.</description>
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		<title>By: Marie</title>
		<link>http://johnaugust.com/archives/2006/race-and-the-screenwriter/comment-page-1#comment-4901</link>
		<dc:creator>Marie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jan 2006 08:55:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnaugust.com/?p=548#comment-4901</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;OK, I hate those people who comment and run and don&#039;t circle back around.  First of all, I really do dig the blog.  I think you do a great job staying focused on the job at hand -- helping people realize their dreams of screenwriting.  I digressed with the Hmong background, but I think they got a raw deal.  Your &quot;giant crazy liberal&quot;-ness aside -- I don&#039;t mean to &quot;lump&quot; you in with The Man politically, merely ethnically.  I&#039;m not mistaking how hard it is to work in Hollywood with racism, I&#039;d like to move the discussion more into imagining how much harder it is when you have to deal with people saying ignorant things that really don&#039;t have a bearing on how a movie will perform -- creatively or otherwise.  Good for you for working with Sundance and, I&#039;m sure, other non-profit groups that pluck people from obscurity and help them learn the craft of writing.  I like the folks over there.  I was actually talking about baby writers who get one or two jobs and just can&#039;t figure out the game fast enough to stay in it.  There&#039;s nobody really helping them.  I&#039;ve been very fortunate in my career to have been mentored by a few very well-placed people, people who took the time to call me into their offices and ask me how I was doing, who heard through the grapevine that I was struggling and reached out to let me know everyone struggled, and who, occassionally ran interference for me when otherwise I would have been burnt up by a rampaging agent, writer or studio exec.  Anyway, write on, I had an ignorant exchange on a blog I keep the other day, and that isht messed me up for days.  Do your thing.  It&#039;s working.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK, I hate those people who comment and run and don&#8217;t circle back around.  First of all, I really do dig the blog.  I think you do a great job staying focused on the job at hand &#8212; helping people realize their dreams of screenwriting.  I digressed with the Hmong background, but I think they got a raw deal.  Your &#8220;giant crazy liberal&#8221;-ness aside &#8212; I don&#8217;t mean to &#8220;lump&#8221; you in with The Man politically, merely ethnically.  I&#8217;m not mistaking how hard it is to work in Hollywood with racism, I&#8217;d like to move the discussion more into imagining how much harder it is when you have to deal with people saying ignorant things that really don&#8217;t have a bearing on how a movie will perform &#8212; creatively or otherwise.  Good for you for working with Sundance and, I&#8217;m sure, other non-profit groups that pluck people from obscurity and help them learn the craft of writing.  I like the folks over there.  I was actually talking about baby writers who get one or two jobs and just can&#8217;t figure out the game fast enough to stay in it.  There&#8217;s nobody really helping them.  I&#8217;ve been very fortunate in my career to have been mentored by a few very well-placed people, people who took the time to call me into their offices and ask me how I was doing, who heard through the grapevine that I was struggling and reached out to let me know everyone struggled, and who, occassionally ran interference for me when otherwise I would have been burnt up by a rampaging agent, writer or studio exec.  Anyway, write on, I had an ignorant exchange on a blog I keep the other day, and that isht messed me up for days.  Do your thing.  It&#8217;s working.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: John August</title>
		<link>http://johnaugust.com/archives/2006/race-and-the-screenwriter/comment-page-1#comment-4899</link>
		<dc:creator>John August</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jan 2006 19:34:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnaugust.com/?p=548#comment-4899</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Marie,&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Glad you dig the blog.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;What I find so arrogant about your post are the assumptions.  So let me clear up a few.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;When I say Hmong is an interesting word, that&#039;s not cultural imperialism, or ethnocentrism. It&#039;s an observation of the fact that words in English generally don&#039;t start with &quot;Hm.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;It&#039;s dandy that you know about how the Hmong came to America.  As you might guess, I knew a lot about it too.  Many of the Scout projects in my troop involved helping out the Hmong community in Boulder.  If charity work is patronizing or culturally destructive, I can&#039;t fix that.  I don&#039;t think the Khmer Rouge or the CIA has a lot of bearing on the discussion of race and screenwriting, however.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;You assume I&#039;m not mentoring any young black writers.  You&#039;re wrong.  And that was very sloppy guess-making on your part, because a little Googling would reveal I&#039;m a frequent advisor to Sundance and other screenwriting labs, each of which has the goal of increasing the diversity of voices in film.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I don&#039;t make a big fuss about how mutli-culturally enlightened I am, because that always feels like excuse-making.   I am a white guy from an upper-middle-class background.  That doesn&#039;t make me a monster.  And it pisses me off that you&#039;d lump me in with The Man trying to keep the black guy off the one-sheet poster.  I&#039;m not an apologist for Hollywood, trust me, but there&#039;s a dangerous tendency to mistake how hard it is for anyone to make it in the industry with racism.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I tend to underplay what a giant crazy liberal I am because I want any aspiring screenwriter to feel like this site is for him or her, regardless of political beliefs.  If anything, I try to keep the blog the way I&#039;d like to industry to be: open to all.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marie,</p>

<p>Glad you dig the blog.</p>

<p>What I find so arrogant about your post are the assumptions.  So let me clear up a few.</p>

<p>When I say Hmong is an interesting word, that&#8217;s not cultural imperialism, or ethnocentrism. It&#8217;s an observation of the fact that words in English generally don&#8217;t start with &#8220;Hm.&#8221;</p>

<p>It&#8217;s dandy that you know about how the Hmong came to America.  As you might guess, I knew a lot about it too.  Many of the Scout projects in my troop involved helping out the Hmong community in Boulder.  If charity work is patronizing or culturally destructive, I can&#8217;t fix that.  I don&#8217;t think the Khmer Rouge or the CIA has a lot of bearing on the discussion of race and screenwriting, however.</p>

<p>You assume I&#8217;m not mentoring any young black writers.  You&#8217;re wrong.  And that was very sloppy guess-making on your part, because a little Googling would reveal I&#8217;m a frequent advisor to Sundance and other screenwriting labs, each of which has the goal of increasing the diversity of voices in film.</p>

<p>I don&#8217;t make a big fuss about how mutli-culturally enlightened I am, because that always feels like excuse-making.   I am a white guy from an upper-middle-class background.  That doesn&#8217;t make me a monster.  And it pisses me off that you&#8217;d lump me in with The Man trying to keep the black guy off the one-sheet poster.  I&#8217;m not an apologist for Hollywood, trust me, but there&#8217;s a dangerous tendency to mistake how hard it is for anyone to make it in the industry with racism.</p>

<p>I tend to underplay what a giant crazy liberal I am because I want any aspiring screenwriter to feel like this site is for him or her, regardless of political beliefs.  If anything, I try to keep the blog the way I&#8217;d like to industry to be: open to all.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Marie</title>
		<link>http://johnaugust.com/archives/2006/race-and-the-screenwriter/comment-page-1#comment-4898</link>
		<dc:creator>Marie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jan 2006 07:51:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnaugust.com/?p=548#comment-4898</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Before I begin my rant, let me say I dig your blog, your work and your general attitude, so I know this is gonna sound harsh, but the above post was a bit like Marie Antoinette offering cake to the masses at the gates.  All this talk about &quot;diversity passes&quot; and giving characters &quot;ethnic&quot; names because it&#039;s &quot;more interesting&quot;, is a bunch of blah blah blah.  In the social sciences they call it ethnocentrism or cultural imperialism -- in terms of this discussion my point is that white culture is so high on its own supply that it has become a charitable act to include nonwhite male characters in lead or major supporting roles.  When the Hollywood filmmaking community gets off its segregated ass and MINGLES with the rest of the world, Diversity in your writing won&#039;t be such a big issue.  Folks with friends, family and acquaintances of every stripe know what I&#039;m talking about already.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;And, John, the  Hmong were distributed throughout the US based on non-profit charitable organizations (mostly christian protestant and catholic groups) after they played a pivotal role in our mostly secret, mostly illegal CIA-led operations in Laos and Cambodia (performed largely in defiance of congressional directives) during the latter half of the conflict in Southeast Asia.  They provided military intelligence and guides through the back country as our government sent in military and CIA (and other, darker groups) sponsored opps to disrupt the communist influence from Centra Asia into Southeast Asia.  We brought them here because the Khmer Rouge and other regimes were exterminating them for helping us.  We didn&#039;t give them lessons on living in an industrialised world, just basically dumped them from a tropical semi-nomadic existence into places like colorado, minnesota and the dakotas with very few social services.   A number of them died after setting fires in their living rooms because they didn&#039;t understand how to use central heat, stoves, ovens, etcs., a few pried open elevator doors (with resultant tragedies) trying to get out of their apartment buildings, but many went on to assimilate into American culture.  My optometrist in NYC is from a family group that was resettled in Minnesota and she was shocked that I knew anything at all about her ethnic group -- she was accustomed to being mistaken for Chinese, Vietnamese or Laotian.  They have a beautiful language and script.  Kudos to your mom for helping them.  You should find out more about them.  It might help with your diversity issues.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I&#039;m glad to see you address these types of topics on your blogs, but, in my (vociferous) opinion, the latest battle in America is this ethnocentric attitude that pervades people of all backgrounds in the country.  It just sucks that white men have been exploiting others for hundreds of years so your ethnocentrism causes more damage (for now, anyway, I&#039;ve got my eyes peeled, though).  I worked in the studio system, at a production company and in physical production for the last ten years or so, and, while it&#039;s better than when I started, I&#039;ve sat in on so many development and production meetings with people saying things like &quot;black people don&#039;t speak English&quot; or &quot;we need a white guy on the poster&quot;.  I always speak up, but frankly white men listen to other white men so it&#039;s up to you and your white male friends to work this out.  I&#039;m counting on you.  For more than just a few names in a script.  Champion a young nonwhite male writer.  Hell, mentor one.  It&#039;s not like there are that many opportunities for writers of color to get out of the black movie ghetto and work on mainstream films, and as you know, film is experiential -- you learn by doing.  I hope your blood isn&#039;t boiling reading this.  We are each a product of our cultures....  And I do dig the blog.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Before I begin my rant, let me say I dig your blog, your work and your general attitude, so I know this is gonna sound harsh, but the above post was a bit like Marie Antoinette offering cake to the masses at the gates.  All this talk about &#8220;diversity passes&#8221; and giving characters &#8220;ethnic&#8221; names because it&#8217;s &#8220;more interesting&#8221;, is a bunch of blah blah blah.  In the social sciences they call it ethnocentrism or cultural imperialism &#8212; in terms of this discussion my point is that white culture is so high on its own supply that it has become a charitable act to include nonwhite male characters in lead or major supporting roles.  When the Hollywood filmmaking community gets off its segregated ass and MINGLES with the rest of the world, Diversity in your writing won&#8217;t be such a big issue.  Folks with friends, family and acquaintances of every stripe know what I&#8217;m talking about already.</p>

<p>And, John, the  Hmong were distributed throughout the US based on non-profit charitable organizations (mostly christian protestant and catholic groups) after they played a pivotal role in our mostly secret, mostly illegal CIA-led operations in Laos and Cambodia (performed largely in defiance of congressional directives) during the latter half of the conflict in Southeast Asia.  They provided military intelligence and guides through the back country as our government sent in military and CIA (and other, darker groups) sponsored opps to disrupt the communist influence from Centra Asia into Southeast Asia.  We brought them here because the Khmer Rouge and other regimes were exterminating them for helping us.  We didn&#8217;t give them lessons on living in an industrialised world, just basically dumped them from a tropical semi-nomadic existence into places like colorado, minnesota and the dakotas with very few social services.   A number of them died after setting fires in their living rooms because they didn&#8217;t understand how to use central heat, stoves, ovens, etcs., a few pried open elevator doors (with resultant tragedies) trying to get out of their apartment buildings, but many went on to assimilate into American culture.  My optometrist in NYC is from a family group that was resettled in Minnesota and she was shocked that I knew anything at all about her ethnic group &#8212; she was accustomed to being mistaken for Chinese, Vietnamese or Laotian.  They have a beautiful language and script.  Kudos to your mom for helping them.  You should find out more about them.  It might help with your diversity issues.</p>

<p>I&#8217;m glad to see you address these types of topics on your blogs, but, in my (vociferous) opinion, the latest battle in America is this ethnocentric attitude that pervades people of all backgrounds in the country.  It just sucks that white men have been exploiting others for hundreds of years so your ethnocentrism causes more damage (for now, anyway, I&#8217;ve got my eyes peeled, though).  I worked in the studio system, at a production company and in physical production for the last ten years or so, and, while it&#8217;s better than when I started, I&#8217;ve sat in on so many development and production meetings with people saying things like &#8220;black people don&#8217;t speak English&#8221; or &#8220;we need a white guy on the poster&#8221;.  I always speak up, but frankly white men listen to other white men so it&#8217;s up to you and your white male friends to work this out.  I&#8217;m counting on you.  For more than just a few names in a script.  Champion a young nonwhite male writer.  Hell, mentor one.  It&#8217;s not like there are that many opportunities for writers of color to get out of the black movie ghetto and work on mainstream films, and as you know, film is experiential &#8212; you learn by doing.  I hope your blood isn&#8217;t boiling reading this.  We are each a product of our cultures&#8230;.  And I do dig the blog.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: chris</title>
		<link>http://johnaugust.com/archives/2006/race-and-the-screenwriter/comment-page-1#comment-4862</link>
		<dc:creator>chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Jan 2006 01:53:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnaugust.com/?p=548#comment-4862</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Georgie says:&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;&quot;I find it amusing that Craig Mazin feels he is such an authority on screenwriting when his credits are as limited as they are.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;If Geogie knew anything s/he would realize that much of the scriptwriters work goes uncredited because of such business as script doctoring. Also... does Georgie have any credits, at all, to compare?&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;If not, s/he must realize then, that getting even one legitimate credit is a feat unto itself. That to write a script, any script, that a producer actually wants to risk his/her reputation and millions of dollars makes that writer a success. At least, more of a success than people who critisize produced writers with having &quot;credits (that are) limited.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Georgie says:</p>

<p>&#8220;I find it amusing that Craig Mazin feels he is such an authority on screenwriting when his credits are as limited as they are.&#8221;</p>

<p>If Geogie knew anything s/he would realize that much of the scriptwriters work goes uncredited because of such business as script doctoring. Also&#8230; does Georgie have any credits, at all, to compare?</p>

<p>If not, s/he must realize then, that getting even one legitimate credit is a feat unto itself. That to write a script, any script, that a producer actually wants to risk his/her reputation and millions of dollars makes that writer a success. At least, more of a success than people who critisize produced writers with having &#8220;credits (that are) limited.&#8221;</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: John August</title>
		<link>http://johnaugust.com/archives/2006/race-and-the-screenwriter/comment-page-1#comment-4841</link>
		<dc:creator>John August</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jan 2006 19:43:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnaugust.com/?p=548#comment-4841</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Craig:&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Yes, Hmong is a fun word.  My mom was an ESL teacher, and most of her students were Hmong.  No, really.  There&#039;s a community of them in Boulder, for whatever reason.  So I never missed an opportunity to say &quot;Hmong&quot; growing up.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Craig:</p>

<p>Yes, Hmong is a fun word.  My mom was an ESL teacher, and most of her students were Hmong.  No, really.  There&#8217;s a community of them in Boulder, for whatever reason.  So I never missed an opportunity to say &#8220;Hmong&#8221; growing up.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Dara</title>
		<link>http://johnaugust.com/archives/2006/race-and-the-screenwriter/comment-page-1#comment-4826</link>
		<dc:creator>Dara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jan 2006 05:50:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnaugust.com/?p=548#comment-4826</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Uhm... just a quickie to add... has anyone else considered that a good time to make a character a particular race is when it&#039;s &lt;em&gt;relevant&lt;/em&gt; to his/her character? I&#039;m from New York, a theater geek, and strongly Jewish, but marrying a half-Mexican, ex-Evangelical Christian.  If we were characters in a script, you&#039;d have to mention the ethnicities to get a clearer picture of who we are and how this might color our relationship (even if the movie had NOTHING to do with that). Along with everything else we&#039;re writing for, and despite trying our best to conserve words for the sake of readability, I hope part of the reason we do this is to create great characters. Isn&#039;t race often part of that equation?&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Uhm&#8230; just a quickie to add&#8230; has anyone else considered that a good time to make a character a particular race is when it&#8217;s <em>relevant</em> to his/her character? I&#8217;m from New York, a theater geek, and strongly Jewish, but marrying a half-Mexican, ex-Evangelical Christian.  If we were characters in a script, you&#8217;d have to mention the ethnicities to get a clearer picture of who we are and how this might color our relationship (even if the movie had NOTHING to do with that). Along with everything else we&#8217;re writing for, and despite trying our best to conserve words for the sake of readability, I hope part of the reason we do this is to create great characters. Isn&#8217;t race often part of that equation?</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: taZ</title>
		<link>http://johnaugust.com/archives/2006/race-and-the-screenwriter/comment-page-1#comment-4818</link>
		<dc:creator>taZ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jan 2006 00:09:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnaugust.com/?p=548#comment-4818</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Yes, maybe it seem that way. Maybe it&#039;s sad. But that&#039;s the way the audience is used to it.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Anyway, my point was the REASON part. There is always a reason. Not accidental ethnicity.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, maybe it seem that way. Maybe it&#8217;s sad. But that&#8217;s the way the audience is used to it.</p>

<p>Anyway, my point was the REASON part. There is always a reason. Not accidental ethnicity.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mac</title>
		<link>http://johnaugust.com/archives/2006/race-and-the-screenwriter/comment-page-1#comment-4817</link>
		<dc:creator>Mac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jan 2006 21:50:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnaugust.com/?p=548#comment-4817</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Taz commented: &quot;..  if I want to write about a guy thatâ€™s really good with martial arts, I will pick an Asian. If I want a police officer, I probably choose an American with FBI style. If I want a quick mouth fellow, I will prefer an African American. ...  Now, there is nothing racist about that. &quot;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Maybe not, but there is something very bland about that.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Mac.
(PS: The only time I have ever visited a Hmong village, I met a Hmong kid who had red hair.  So even the audience may not know that he is Hmong !)&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Taz commented: &#8220;..  if I want to write about a guy thatâ€™s really good with martial arts, I will pick an Asian. If I want a police officer, I probably choose an American with FBI style. If I want a quick mouth fellow, I will prefer an African American. &#8230;  Now, there is nothing racist about that. &#8220;</p>

<p>Maybe not, but there is something very bland about that.</p>

<p>Mac.
(PS: The only time I have ever visited a Hmong village, I met a Hmong kid who had red hair.  So even the audience may not know that he is Hmong !)</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Derek Haas</title>
		<link>http://johnaugust.com/archives/2006/race-and-the-screenwriter/comment-page-1#comment-4815</link>
		<dc:creator>Derek Haas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jan 2006 19:28:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnaugust.com/?p=548#comment-4815</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;John,
I agree with you.  Every script doesn&#039;t need to give us the Benetton nation, but all the characters, even the minor ones, should be interesting and memorable.  As soon as you name a character Yoko Imanishi instead of Anna Ramsey... or Seamus O&#039;Dooley instead of Jack Cole... you are going to write your dialogue more interestingly too, I would posit.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John,
I agree with you.  Every script doesn&#8217;t need to give us the Benetton nation, but all the characters, even the minor ones, should be interesting and memorable.  As soon as you name a character Yoko Imanishi instead of Anna Ramsey&#8230; or Seamus O&#8217;Dooley instead of Jack Cole&#8230; you are going to write your dialogue more interestingly too, I would posit.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Jeff in D.C.</title>
		<link>http://johnaugust.com/archives/2006/race-and-the-screenwriter/comment-page-1#comment-4814</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff in D.C.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jan 2006 17:42:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnaugust.com/?p=548#comment-4814</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Who was behind the casting in Love Actually? All the diversity felt forced.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who was behind the casting in Love Actually? All the diversity felt forced.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Stephen Gallagher</title>
		<link>http://johnaugust.com/archives/2006/race-and-the-screenwriter/comment-page-1#comment-4813</link>
		<dc:creator>Stephen Gallagher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jan 2006 16:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://johnaugust.com/?p=548#comment-4813</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Let&#039;s face it, you never get exactly what you ask for when you lay detail into a script, but it makes sense to push your interpreters to raise their game. You may not get the tattooed Iranian you specified but at least you&#039;ve jolted everyone into thinking about the character.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let&#8217;s face it, you never get exactly what you ask for when you lay detail into a script, but it makes sense to push your interpreters to raise their game. You may not get the tattooed Iranian you specified but at least you&#8217;ve jolted everyone into thinking about the character.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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